"I liked him better when he was insulting us in English. Newt Rich-Gringo shows us how calm a man can keep his face as he murders the Spanish Language in broad daylight"

Beer. Up my nose.

It kind of hurts, but I'm still laughing.

Estupido gringo de mierda.

Ok, I'll say it so you can understand it Newt (gawd your mother didn't like you, did she!)

DON'T RAPE MY LANGUAGE!

Eh, Rafa, Vete a la v*rga. Uds quejan tanto de lo racista que somos, simplemnte para decir luego 'gringo de mierda'? No manches! I can get denouncing this as a transparent and condescending piece of political theater, but getting pissy about someone's accent, and then getting all racist on top of it, just isn't cricket.

As someone who speaks Spanish as a second language I resent it when someone craps all over my, or anybody else's, accent or difficulties. I defend non-native speakers of English when jerks try and make fun of them so I think Anglos are entitled to the same courtesy when they try to speak Spanish, however poorly and with whatever ulterior motives. If an Anglo put up a post about how some Mexican politician was butchering the English language on CNN you just know Nezua would be all over it, and rightly so. The civilized response to someone who butchers your language is to smile politely and thank them for trying.

Get it? If you want people to move beyond the 'remote control' learning of your culture that our host so detests, it helps to invite them in.

Not all of us are blessed with being as perfectly bilingual as you. I invite you to stop being such a linguistic chauvinist. He's not raping your language, he's conceding its importance and growing relevance by deigning to use it.

Linguist chauvinist, thats a new one. My anger does not come from someone trying to speak any language, it does come from the naked attempt at sympathy the day after he called it a ghetto language. For god sakes have some translate. An apology was due, but this, this was bad. And besides my anger toward Newt goes beyond this point, his positions. This feels more like spousal abuse than an apology, he beats us up one day and then gives us flowers the next. The hell with that, I rarely get this angry, but when I do I'll voice it. And btw, I can't go there, that something you either have or don't.

Me puedo ir al carajo....but I don't have money for the bus tickets.

Newt me hace reir como nadie. Este tipo es un auténtico genio del humor involuntario!

This is even better than when Trent Lott was trying to display his hip-ness with Black People after the Strom Thurmond incident, going on BET network and proclaiming his great admiration for Sanford and Son, the MLK Holiday, Ice Cube rap lyrics and all things Black and Happenin'. You just can't make this stuff up.

Newt, buddy, pal, wanna make it up to us (sorta)? Pues repase su historia norteamericana un poquito, en cualquier idioma que prefiere. Vaya al capítulo sobre la guerra estadounidense-- er, uh, I guess y'all call it "the Mexican War" around these parts, Newtie. In fact, go and start before that, read up on that region that we today call "California" and "Arizona" and "New Mexico", on "Los Angeles" and "Santa Fe" and "San Diego" before 1846-- funny how those cities and states are all Spanish-sounding Newtie, wonder how that happened?

And while you're at it, Newtie, since you claim to be such a historian, why not do what a historian does and go back to the primary sources-- things like land grants, deeds, laws, newspapers, books, theatrical scripts, sales receipts and whatnot, from California to Texas (and Florida while you're at it), both before *and even after* 1846 to 1848? Funny thing, Newtie, how all those materials of daily society, of high culture, mass media and even scientific investigations, were all in Chicano Spanish.

That's right, Newtie, the ghetto language of español was the civilizational foundation of the US Southwest, the basis for the urban "high culture" there and the language of farmer and urban mayor alike. Thus by your exalted standards, Newtie, so as to "assimilate" and to join the high culture of the region, all these unassimilated Anglo, uh, "immigrants" in the Southwest should stop speaking English by the third generation and speak exclusively in Spanish from then on. That's what this whole "melting pot" thing means, right, Newt? Que todos los "recién llegados" deberían adoptar la idioma fundacional del lugar?

But hey, Newt, I'm all for "the more, the merrier" and all that, so why don't we come to a mutually beneficial compromise. We'll be cool with your Anglo-ness here Newt-- even despite all your invasions, brutalizations, imperialism and all that-- and you can display your Anglo-ness and Anglo-Protestant-ness here if you like. We'll even absorb some of the best elements of it. But never, ever demand that your English and your Anglo-ness "take precedence" over español and our cultural heritage here in general. Never demand that we give it up, and never demand that español be relegated merely to the "private sphere" or that the Latino culture be considered "merely an immigrant culture" here to be given up soon enough. Español is a public language here, and not only will we be retaining it permanently, but upstanding Anglos like yourself, Newt, should be learning it as well.

Asi vamos a enriquecernos mutuamente. Y eso es la meta del "intercambio cultural" que celebramos tanto en este pais, eh, Newt? Or do you just prefer the old Anglo Imperialistic model, Newt? Methinks you're losing adherents these days, Newt, what with the "fruits" of Anglo imperialism on full display in Iraq and Iran. Pues, trato hecho, Newt? El intercambio cultural verdadero, para el bueno del pueblo aqui en general?

Ben, please see Nezua's writings on the Fallacious Flip which you've just employed. As I see it, it's not Rafael's or anyone's job to "invite" you into their culture, especially after centuries of war and oppression and exploitation against that culture by the dominant culture. If you're interested in learning about another ethnicity or culture, you approach with palms together and ask occasinal questions with respect and wait to be invited in rather than demanding to be; you don't get to make up the rules of how you're to be treated and demand gratitude for being interested and threaten to stomp out of the room if people are meanies. Personally I can see no racism in pushing back against and mocking an overt racist pussbag like Rich-Gringo (lol) in whatever terms seem warranted, after he "invited" himself into someone else's house and shat all over the living room. I think the accent is fair game because he's the one who made this about language as it relates to class and race; in a certain sense, his putrid accent embodies his hypocrisy, his fatuous conceit and condescension, his duplicitous bigotry.

Ben, Anglos who speak English never needed to be "invited in" to the Spanish-speaking sphere before! They just came with weapons and a sense of superiority. Just like Rich-Gringo did the other day. He carried weapons of degradation and the Same Ole Hate. It ain't like we're all mocking some English-speaker who is politely inquiring as to donde esta el baño, por favor at the counter of a store in a strange town. This is a man who is now only apologizing to voting hands. He's happy he got to spit his shit the other day, and he'll do it again. So 'scuse us if we don't swallow his condescending rap with a smile, eh? As Kai put it in his own loquacious manner, I think the invitation is lost in the mail, vato. Mebbe Anglos gonna hafta take a walk and knock now.

get it?

Rafa, Thank you for your response.

Kai, I read the definition of Fallacious Flip. I can see how my comment could be construed as oppressive.

Let me zero in then on what really set me off and cede the rest of my comment. Rafa called him a "gringo de mierda" making specific reference to his race/culture. I realize if I were to say I would never employ someone's race when complaining about their politics or behavior I would be walking straight back into the Fallacious Flip again.

So here's a question for any commenter that reads this. What, if any, is the non-oppressive, non-fallacious way to take issue when someone here employs language that in my context is racist? I'd try to answer this one myself but as I might fall into another previously undefined error it seems better to just ask.

ben i appreciate you asking and thinking on this. i hope your mind is actually open. ps: "previously undefined" = "hidden speech rules." but they are not hidden nor undefined. just unknown to you. so i find it encouraging that you are asking.

but it will obviously help us to define terms before we try to use them as linchpins of any arguments.

you claim Latinos can be "racist" against Anglos, so to me you and i (and safe to say kai and rafa, as i know their feelings on this, i think) are working off of different ideas of the term "Racist." i think it would help if you laid out your idea of what "Racism" is, as well as a "Racist."

then rafa and kai (and i or anyone else who comes along), know what is in your thinking when you say these words and we can go from there.

Oh God. It is obvious he doesn't speak any Spanish ... he has practiced this and is reading it from cue cards.

and look how many splices there are in the piece! i'd love to see the outtakes.

Nezua,
You ask how I define racist and racism. I'll lay out my definition and understanding. First though... I judge people through intent, which you divorce from racism. This is, honestly, a difficult concept for me to get my head around. The best I've been able to do is form an analogy: The harm that Anglos do through a failure to recognize or sympathize is negligence. A kind of verbal equivalent to manslaughter.

A racist, to me, is someone who engages in racism or acts on racist views (and to hold those views is almost always to act on them even if only in some subtle way.)

Racism for me is judging or hurting someone for something they have no control over. It is at heart a double standard. Hundreds of white people kill others in drunk driving accidents and it barely makes the news. One undocumented Mexican does and all of the sudden O'Reilly goes ballistic. Not because of what the person DID but because of WHO THEY ARE.

From what I understand (and please feel free to correct me) you define racism as harm coupled with power and intertwined with history. I agree with this to a point. Minorities are always much more aware of the majority than vice versa, much more aware of the majority's cultural norms,and are harmed disproportionately. For this reason Kai said the flip was fallacious.

In the end though, I think that, even if it's disproportionate, Latinos can do that kind of harm and use that kind of double standard. Cracking someone's false self-image of being accepting or non-racist so they can see and constructively deal with the assumptions underneath is one thing, and is not racist. Calling someone cracker or gringo de mierda is not about doing anything constructive and would be.

On Rafa's second comment, I came to understand that it wasn't about Newt being a gringo at all, so the harm was reversed.

Ben,
A simple way to put it is racism = power and privilege. Resentment from any POC against white people does have any structural impact on their lives. POC do not have the power enforce their biases like white people do. They do not have the power to determine where white people live, their access to education, or their livelihood. To complain about "racist" poc is profoundly petty, as it glosses over the power dynamics at play in a white supremacist society.

Delurking....

Newt's trying as usual to have it both ways; all he had to do was make a short drive down Windy Hill Road or South Cobb Drive (both in his former Congressional district) and he could have found dozens of people who could translate for him better than his staff could have.

Relurking

Ben, I do appreciate your thoughtful measured response to what must have seemed like somewhat harsh rebukes. It sounds like you're thinking about and learning about some of these terms and concepts with an open mind, and if so I applaud you.

"Racism" is certainly a complex term about which much debate exists. There's no consensus. From the sound of it, you equate racism mostly with interpersonal dynamics; emotionally-hurtful rudeness or name-calling between individuals. However, people of color generally don't see it that way. I see racism as a socio-political, cultural, and economic system of power, privilege, and oppression, built into the institutions of our society; built into our courts, banks, corporations. Racism is a backdrop, so to speak. Racism suggests an asymmetry of power, privilege, and oppression. For me, racism in America is really inseparable from the overarching historical reality and ongoing legacy of white supremacy.

As I see it, interpersonal insults are trivial compared to the big economic issues, disparities in education and housing and employment and healthcare, racial profiling, unjust incarceration, dehumanization, denial of personhood and agency, political marginalization, media stereotyping, hate crimes, human rights abuses, etc, that people of color endure. So Newt Gingrich is racist because his political rhetoric and philosophical posture support all of those white supremacist institutions. At the same time, defending oneself against such onslaught however one sees fit does not constitute racism to me.

So a racially-based insult hurled toward a white person might be lame, stupid, bigoted, incendiary, moronic, uncalled for, deserving of a beatdown; but it's not racism as I've described above. Because racism is supported by the powers that be, the law, the system.

Does that help?

Thanks for engaging.

Peace.

I am reposting the email i sent to ben.

Hey Ben. Sorry I'm short on time right now. I probably shouldn't speak for Kai and Rafa, really. But I see Racism as based on a power structure and a history of oppression. I have a lot to write on this, I've done a lot in pieces, and I'm thinking on a post that touches on these things since you brought it up. It's important stuff.

>>>What would you call the harm (of say being called cracker or gringo de mierda) if not racist?

I would call the harm one where nobody has to like it, you don't have to take it (you can leave the area), and it is a hurtful remark that I wouldn't like either. But it is not the same as calling a brown person "-—-—-" or "———." [redacted for public consumption] Because the latter calls up years and years of oppression and exploitation, and reminds all that there is a dominant culture that feels very much this way. The "power" aspect is that as a White, you can tap into that massive force of past wrongs and present threat. That is the key. Power. You are just talking about an insult based on Race. Not Racist speech, by my definition. Doesn't mean its nice, doesnt meant its right. But you have to always consider the larger picture you are tapping into.

>>>How do you feel it should be dealt with by Anglos?

I feel that an Anglo/White should question why they need to assert their power in a "brown blog". The power of Whites lording privilege over the brown is ubiquitous. There are very few spaces that are safe for the Brown. My blog is one. It's a place that its better to listen more than you jump up to assert white rights. Not saying it wouldn't hurt to hear these thigns [you have to say]. Just saying consider the hurts of the minorities. THey deal with many more than White males, bro! They deal with feeling like a piece of shit every day because of the dominant culture's constant memes. And if you are aware of their history and your own, you might understand more why its so unbalanced and you dont have the right to swing the same way.

In the street or in a store, in your home, in a movie house, in a Kos blog, in my blog....how "an anglo should deal with it" depends on the situation. But in a place like my blog, you have to realize different rules apply. As I said, it is a safe place for blacks and for Latinos [and all other non-whites]...this means that for once, the White people have to feel what it feels like to hear, sometimes, smack talked about themselves and not feel confident jumping up and speaking up for themeslves.

use it as an opportunity to silently think and empathize with the other side.

I know it isnt easy...[in my blog] you hear brown people talk in a way you normally dont, i bet. Just keep respecting the crowd, they will respect you. I aprpeciate that you thought about ev erything we are saying. I will get to your questions later in the thread if someone else doesnt. i gots to run!

Nezua

obviously, i was typing fast and probably would have smoothed it out a lot more if it were a post, or if i were realizing i'd be quoting it directly for the blog. but there it is. thought i should put it out there, and didn't want to pretend i hadn't already typed it out that way.

Kai,
Yes it does indeed help, thank you. I didn't "get" the concept of this kind of structural or systematic racism before even when I read about it because I so equated it with intent, as opposed to harm done.

Buria, a question: In this context, with the definition accepted here, you're right, it's not racist. Where Anglos are the local minority or in a foreign country where POC are the majority and can enforce their bigotry with a power structure, would it then be possible for Anglos to suffer racism (such as the dispossessed white farmers in Zimbabwe)?

Nezua suggested, elsewhere, that I ask myself why I feel the need to assert power here in this space. I was oblivious to the fact that I was even asserting power. I guess that's the whole point.

Anyways thank you all for so graciously refraining from running me off the blog and taking the time to talk to me. Thanks to Nezua for taking the time to email me.

This was enlightening. I'll be around.

Peace.